...And then the children of the village threw stones, screaming "Heretic" and "Fornicator"

Comments

[this is good]
I won't air my opinions here, as it will no doubt offend pretty much everyone, but damn, good post, Cate.
[esto es genial]
[braces for the onslaught]
You tell a story like nobody else, Cate. Seriously, you rock!
Awesome as always. You are such a wonderful writer, not only is this hilarious, I give it 2 bonus gold stars for making fun of crazy religious freaks. This is funny, only because of how awfully true it is.
[this is good]
I totally agree with you. Why is it that us heathens accept people and their beliefs, but the holy ones do nothing but judge? Fantastic post. Amen! :)
[this is good]

lol--i have a freind whose parents are BAC--since he was in high school I think and they have all but disowned him. He had a child out of wedlock and then ended up divorced, living in sin, you know, all the stuff regular people do. They'd help out any member of his church before him. really he has all but disowned them.

I just don't get why the people that act this way think it's their place to judge. Isn't that God's job? I mean, duh. Isn't Jesus supposed to love everyone unconditionally? so why can't they do that? Theyre the ones wearing the WWJD crap. What would Jesus do? He wouldn't be bugging the crap out of me and looking down his nose at me I bet.

[this is good]

I wish more Christians would engage me in religious discussion. Once they get to know me a little, they generally stay clear of the subject. I try to bring it up, but they won't touch it. So, what am I? A total lost cause? They should see me as a challenge, the under-achieving bastards.

It could also be the fact that when they tell me about their "special" relationship with Christ, I'm often inspired to tell them about my close relationship with Lord Satan. I can identify with their enthusiasm. Like their own (weaker) deity, Satan has changed my life in so many wonderful ways that I just want to tell everyone about it. Especially all the poor, deceived Christians. "But, Ben, don't you want to go to Heaven?" I don't know. Will there be beer and porn in Heaven? That's what I thought.

MERRRRY CHRISTMAAAAAAS!

Well as I said while we spoke (and are speaking on chat)...

I'm never going to judge you or make you feel like a "village witch." I am a Christian and I do believe in Christ, you know that, and Jesus would not want me or anyone else to treat you like you were less.

I'm really sorry that you were treated so poorly by other Christians. That is just a crime and a shame. Maybe they thought they were doing what they thought was right at the time, I don't know, but someone, a real christian would have made you feel fellowship and not exclusion by shunning you or treating like a sick animal with a disease.

I think being Christian means helping others, being a true friend, being an inspiration, having compassion and understanding for others. And a lot of other things, but for sure not being as those people were to you.

You know, I know what it's like to be under that scrutiny too. I married into a Mormon family. I was raised Methodist. I've attended church on both sides. I've never in my life encountered such scrutiny then when I go to the Mormon church and they see the crucifix I wear on my chest. They do not believe in the symbol of the crucifix. To them it is sacreligious.

They automatically zone in on my crucifix and with sorrow in their eyes, they embrace me and try to convert me, even though I already believe in Jesus. It's been so frustrating having to turn away the missionaries who knock on my door several times a month. I tell them "its not that I don't believe in God and I need to be saved. I am saved and I DO believe in Jesus.. we just don't want to be a Mormon family!" And I get the "but you do know, we are the true church?"

I don't know that and I don't believe that. Those are my beliefs. I wish they would respect that. From time to time, I still go to a Mormon service, out of respect for my mother in law who is Mormon, but each time I go I get the same looks of sorrow and I sit there, listening to their service called Sacrament Meeting where members of the church go up front and talk about how the church is the "true church." It's really frustrating for me. I just don't understand why they see me as needing to be saved when I believe in the same person as they do!

But I believe they are good people and their heart is in helping people and being good neighbors, all in all.

I do know your frustration and I understand what it's like to judged and how awful that feels.


[this is good]

**already hears the hellacoius uproar this is likely to start**

My issue is the whole judging when their religion tells them not to. And things about all sins being equal - but somehow theirs are okay and everyone else's are not okay.

And that death convo... man, did I ever piss someone off with that convo. He kept saying, "but don't you want to know what will happen to you when you die?" I said "No." Him, "Why not?" Me: "Why does it matter? I'll be dead then."... round and round we went. He could not conceptualize a life NOT spent in preparation for rewards upon death. I could not conceptualize a life spent NOT enjoying rewards of being alive.

[this is good]
Absolutely spot on.

Just last night dad asked me into the living room because he had something to show me. He changed the channel from his "Military Weapons Show" to "Eternal Doom: The Book of Revelations" or whatever the hell was the name of the show. He then looked at me with all seriousness and said "Ashley, you really should sit down and watch this show." I was a bit confused and said "Why? I know what the Book of Revelations is." Then dad said "Well, then you know that those that believe in God and his only son that are Christians are going to heaven when the rapture comes. Those that are non-believers are going to hell." From me "Again, what is your point?" Dad "In our family looks like one of us won't be making it to heaven..." I was floored!

I stopped going to church when I turned 21. I couldn't stand to be around "Saturday Night Sinners" (including my parents) who felt like God was going to give them the keys to heaven because they went to church for an hour on Sunday. But my worst offense was not joining "the Church" when I was 14. The way my parents talked Satan himself was going to personally rip the soul from my body at any moment.
Oh, and you don't have to be christian to help others, be a true friend, be an inspiration, have compassion and understanding for others.
[esto es genial]

2nd note: This is also why I joined the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. I was touched by his noodly appendage and am a proud Pastafarian. In the Church of the FSM, if we're intent on converting someone to spend their life planning for an after-life in our heaven of beer volcanos and a stripper factory, we at least have the decency to dress in full pirate regalia!

Ramen!

Paperheart... shame on your father for saying that to you.
That's disgusting he would treat you, his own daughter, like that.


I've come to expect no less than that from my father. Both my parents really. The great irony is that I have a very strong belief in God. I just chose to follow God in a different way.
[this is good]

indeed, cate. indeed. that's about all i can say.

ok, one more thing--i have an aunt who is BAC. she's rather subtle about it sometimes, but she definitely gets her witness on around me and my brothers.

and my mother the catholic doesn't understand that I DON'T WANT TO GO to christmas mass next monday, and in fact AM NOT going, despite the fact that i live under her roof at the moment. me = grownup. me = old enough to choose my own religious leanings. v. frustrating.

i'm rather intrigued by this Lord Satan Ben mentions above me here. Ben, can you tell me more?

[this is good]

So been there...and came to the conclusion that the least 'Christian' people are those that are Christian...

I love thy neighbour CupCate! ;Þ

Oh, I certainly can.

(Insert maniacal laughter.)

Satan loves everyone. He doesn't judge anyone, and he always has candy. The only downside is that he tends to make everything smell like goat. And he says "seriously" a lot.

Religions ARE about judging. You are supposed to judge the acts of others according to whether or not they are in line with your religion, and act (or even punish) accordingly. How can a person say they're not judging if they believe people who don't conform to certain of their religious beliefs will go to hell, or earn disapproval by an often rathful and vengeful God (see: the Bible)? That seems like a huge contradiction.

Judgement is the reason why Christian and Muslim proselytizing exists- because these people judge other people's religions and cultures (some of them thousands of years old) to be so backwards and inferior, that they must "save" them from their evil pagan ways. Sure, the thought is nice in theory (save people from burning in hell- though nobody's ever actually come back and confirmed hell's existence, anyway), but it is awfully presumptuous and judgemental to feel that your way is the only way to eternal peace. Plus, it is gross when people try to convert others because they want to earn points towards heaven.

All the love-y Jesus stuff may give people a nice fuzzy feeling in their tummies, but it doesn't disguise the fact that religion IS about enlarging the flock and keeping them in check. Religious people (those whose lives are shaped by their religion) have to judge people and believe that other religions are inferior, because if they didn't, their whole school of thought and way of living would mean very little.

My brother's mother-in-law is like that. She's a born again Christian and a judgemental hypocrite. She doesn't like my brother because he's not "saved" and she acts like she's better than everyone. She's also a hypocrite in the sense that she doesn't give out candy at Halloween cause she believes it's "heathen holiday", yet she had no problem taking her grandson out to the other houses and getting candy for him. I can't stand people like that. In my opinion the people who consider themselves Christians yet treat people that way...judging them and in some cases, hating them...they're the ones who should be worried about going to hell. I believe in God, but I don't judge others for not believing. I believe that if God is anything like he's been described then he accepts everyone exactly the way they are...as long as a person does their best in life and tries to be a good person to others...that's all that matters. I smoke, I drink...I've had sex...and yet I have manners and am polite to others and try and treat others kindly...I like to think that the way I treat other people would be more important when deciding my fate than whether or not I smoke or have sex. But anyway, my point is people like the ones you mentioned above are anything but Christian and are total hypocrites.

P.S. Sorry this is so long...I tend to ramble...

LOL> I am pretty much of the same belief as you. I hate seeing Christians get unfairly bashed but sometimes it feels good because I get it from some of them sometimes.
[this is good]
Great post. I was cringing as you were getting into the story of the baby shower because I could just see what was going to happen. but that took a lot of courage to go and it shows that you really cared about your friend. I had a similar experience in high school where a friend helped me to find Jesus, only I wasn't ready to change my whole life for christ. I would have to stop going to church with my family. (I am Tenrikyo, not Buddhist, not Shinto, Tenrikyo) I would have to stop believing in God the Parent and Oyasama, our Foundress. I would have to turn my whole life around. I was only fifteen years old! No way. So I told her that I couldn't go through with it and she stopped being my friend! It was a tragedy. I loved her! She was so nice to me before that happened. We had biology together and we would sit together and have a lot of fun. I still miss her and regret that it was a lost friendship. But I was able to renew my own faith and it was a big life lesson, so that was good. I really could not understand the christian heaven and hell thing. Why does believing in one person decide where I go after I die? I like the Tenrikyo teaching that heaven and hell are right here on earth. I think it's important to know about other religions and be respectful of others beliefs, but not when they persecute like that. It's not right. I felt really bad about not being able to believe. Why should I feel guilty when God loves us all, we are God's children? Well, thanks for writing what you did.
This is odd, because I almost never am approached by people wanting to save me. Oh, occasionally Mormon missionaries will come to the door, but I send them away with a question for their supervisor and never see them again. Once in a while Jehovah's Witnesses knock, but they're not persistent. But when I'm out and about? I don't think anyone has ever approached me. Perhaps it's the Bible hanging from a chain on my belt (just kidding). Perhaps it's because I'm 6'3", about 250, and dress like Wolfman Jack. Maybe I just look unapproachable. But it's odd.
[this is good]
Great post. Entertaining. Well-written. The funny (strange, not ha ha) thing about organized religion is the conviction almost every faith seems to have that their particular church is the right one, and that if you don't belong, you're doomed -- sheesh, they can't all be right! There are going to be an awful lot of people in hell...
[this is good]
Do NOT tell homosexuals that they're going to hell.

I have a co-worker who is very Christian and loves to talk about it. We had a discussion about homosexuality, and he was telling me about how he has gay friends. Before we even really got into the conversation, I mentioned that this is a hot-button issue for me, and that if he is homophobic he should keep it to himself because I'm very pro-gay rights. (I did put it much more eloquently and gentle than that.) Well, he said, "It's OK, I'm friends with gay people." Then he turned around and said that he preaches Christianity to them because he loves them, and he wants them to see that they are living a sinful lifestyle. BUT they can change. I seriously felt the heat rising into my face and excused myself to go to the little girls' room. I just think about my best friends that are gay, and these people who want to change them are missing out on some great friends.

Living smack dab in the middle of the Bible Belt, this is nothing new to me. I've received every flyer and tract that's been made about why I'm going to Hell. There was one left in our lunch room at work that said, "It doesn't matter if you're a nice person. If you don't accept Jesus Christ into your life, then you are going to Hell." Oh, that's great! So I can be the biggest bitch in the world, but I'm cool if I accept Jesus? Hmmm... Not the right religion for me, that's for sure.

Great post!
[this is good]
[this is once again fabulous] I have now added you as a Vox friend. Great post in so many regards!
[this is good]
I just watched a Morgan Spurlock '30 Days' show about an atheist who stays with a Christian family for a month. I had really no idea it was so hard for agnostics/atheists in the USA. I am sorry the British guy was born-again. There aren't many of them around here, but they seem to be multiplying. I am tired of religion interfering in culture. Wasn't the Enlightenment meant to have happened about 200 years ago?
[this is good]

Fantastic - very eloquent and funny, as usual!

When I went to Uni, I was really shocked at how many Christians there were - where I grew up, no-one was religious and my high school was completely secular. I lived with a BAC in halls, and she was (and still is) a wonderful, caring person who completely redefined, in my mind, what a Christian should be. For about three months, she'd casually suggest if I'd like to go Church with her, but I very firmly said No. I've never really believed in God, and I think that if I ever do turn to a belief system, which will probably be when I'm A LOT older, then my heart and head say 'Buddhism'. But I'm too young, self obsessed and needy to go for all that now, lol.

I always feel a bit strange at this time of the year, because of the whole CHRIST-mas thing as I'm a very firm believer in Christmas even though I'm secular. This uneasiness was typified a couiple of years ago when my friend (also non-religious) asked me to go to a Carol Concert. After PROMISING me that there would'n't be religious readings/preaching-to-the-ungrateful-heathens-who just-go-to-church-"because-it's-Christmas-innit?", I went and very hungover I was too. So the look on my face as I saw a CHURCH - and not only that but a CATHOLIC church - must have been the very definition of "unpleasantly surprised". However, there was a gospel choir and very little preaching so I actually enjoyed it. However, a heathen in God's house didn't get away scot-free, oh no: this was a 'candlelight' concert, hence holding a lit candle with only a bit of cardboard to protect you from the dripping wax. Well, protect in theory - mine was loose so every few seconds, a nice dollop of hot wax would hit my poor hand. And because it a) hurt and b) took me by a surprise, my usual response to both a) and b) is to yell "JESUS!"

So, as you can imagine, that went down well...

BAC? Explanation needed for this non-conforming UK Catholic please.


Born Again Christian! Got it. My only excuse is late night drinking and toking.

No Heaping of Venom on your head, CupCate. Great post. I totally agree with you.

I am (was? Can you give up your religion? You sure can't give up your football team!). OK - I was raised in the Catholic faith, but could never accept some of the things I was taught.

Original Sin - WTF! I think teaching half the population of a church that the sins of the world are their fault has to be pretty fucking counter-productive to keeping them "in the faith" - but that doesn't seem to be the case.

And Go forth and multiply and Man shall have dominion over all the things of land and sea - no fucking wonder the planet is going to hell, taking us all, Christians and Non-Christians alike, with it.

Deal with that, then deal with the rather dubious concept of Heaven and Hell, that's what I think.

But I do feel we have a soul. Just not necessarily a God who gives a shit.

[this is good]

oh yeah! Thankfully I have never been really hit on by the BAC-types, but am in the UK so... *shrug*

Totally deserves to be highlighted!

And yes - I see why they do it, in an intellectual 'how very interesting' sort of way as a cannibal gives recepies, but not in an emotional manner - I cannot believe that it is correct..

Praise the Lord.

Praaaiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiise Him!

This is another good reason I love being Jewish!

It's always fun when someone approaches me, trying to "save me" from damnation and hoping that I'll convert ... I'm an especially complicated case when they find out I'm a JEW -- makes me laugh out loud to see their shock and the ultimate conviction to convert me ... like they'll get extra special points for converting a Jew. ESPs!

Have you seen the Christian vs Christ-follower commercials?? http://www.thinkchristian.net/?p=960 They're a parody of the Mac vs PC commercials, and they're HILARIOUS.

[this is good]
Christians like that break my heart more than any sort of people they call "sinners." It seems so unreal that people actually think that way, and there seems to be no way out of it for them either. Ha, it's funny, I'm trying to come up with ways to "save" them! ;)

Great post!
[das ist gut]

Oh Lordy.

I was really expecting to get shat upon ,lol. I'm glad I'm not the only one who can see the irony, humor, and hypocrosy (sp) in all of this...

Kat, Iain, Marque, Cate & Abigail-

Thank you :) Thank you guys for always reading, I really appreciate it. I'm glad y'all enjoyed the post and took the time to comment...I know how busy things have been lately...I blame Jesus, really.

Ruthypants-

Please tell me you've seen the south park where they talk about Mormons!? It's HILARIOUS. They sing the story of the Mormon religion, and after every fact they sing "Dumb dumb dumb dumb DUMB!"...Anway, what I think is interesting is that my grandparents are tried and true Catholics. They go to Church every Sunday, take part in their community, my grandfather reads at the services, and my grandma is an usher...However. They have Scotch at 4 on the dot EVERY DAY, curse, and when I got a tattoo my 75 year old grandma said, "That's lovely. It looks really nice on you." To me, THAT is a person of God. Forgiving, Accepting, and above all else: Loving.

Ben Martini-

I think Christians don't want to talk to you because they're afraid you'll burst into flames, or want to show them pictures of the gold fish sacrifice we did last weekend at the "Sinning for Lucifer" convention. (The video turned out really well by the way.)

Merry Christmas to you too! God bless us, everyone!

Kristen-

Oh the Mormons. Alas, I don't know what to do about them. I think next time you to go to church at a Mormon church you should wear a cross and carry a pitchfork. I wonder what they would do? Thank you for all your support and understanding :)

Leeeeenda-

Dude. I know. I believe in ghosts. I believe there is something after we die. But am I going to fear hell because it may exist? Eh, no. No I'm not. Anyway, hell sounds like more fun. It'll be warm, we'll probably get a tan, and we can fornicate all we want! Woooo! Oh,and I'm all about the flying spaghetti monster. Let's worship together!

Paperheart-

After your dad said that did you hiss? You should have hissed and started writing all over the floor. Or maybe you should have made your head spin around. I do that now, it get's them everytime. Us heathens are really funny, once you get past the horns. I'm sorry your Dad is like that. If it's not religion, it's always something else.

Aurielis-

May peace be with you, neighbor. (This is the awkward part where we have to shake hands and hug and say 'Peace be with you').

Liz-

Don't go. Tell your mom if you do go, you will hiss and drool and fornicate in the aisles. It's better for her if you don't go, really. Did you want to come to the "Sinning for Lucifer" confrence next month? I'm sure Ben will be there. Lord Satan usually just sends Ben to do his meet and greets, book signings, and crab feeds for him. I'll send you the details.

I really don't believe this just happened.

But I responded to EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOUR COMMENTS.

And then it freaked out.

And ERASED THEM.....

ERASED THEM...

Until I stop losing my mind and regain control and sanity...

Please Enjoy this...

FUCK CHRISTMAS.

[c’est top]

Basically. I'm really frustrated. Who would like to buy me a new laptop? WHO? ANYONE???!?!!?

GAARRRAGGHAHHAAaHAHHAH.

Anway. Let's try this again.

Lord Ben Martini-

Ya know, he does say "seriously" a lot. The goat smell though, I dunno, it always seemed more like damp alpaca, to me. Have you ever noticed how his hooves tend to scratch linolim? I've asked him time and time again to wear the slip covers when he comes over, but NOooooOOoooOO. So stubborn

Cutiebug-

So very well written. Very intellectual, very much spot on. Oh how I bow down to your extreme articulation talents. I usually have to ramble on for about 23 pages that all include 'fuck' before I can get my point across...

LP & Pookie-

LP, I wish that everyone that's "religious" would just spend more time worrying about how they treat other people and try to better the world as it is, verus destroying the one we have and worrying about what MIGHT happen when they die. Pookie (schnookums, sugar plum) I'm going to Google your religion because it sounds very interesting! See? The world would be so much better if we all took an interest in eachother's beliefs, no? We would even, gasp!, understand eachother better!!!

Red Pen-

Well, I imagine their answer to that would be, "Well, the Catholics? They've got it all wrong! Wrong! The Jews? So WRONG! Don't worry, though. We're the truth! There will plenty of room for US in heaven, while those other WRONG religions will burn! Aahaahahah! SUCKERS!"

Bookishly Fab-

Yay for bitches who believe in Jesus going to heaven! That makes so much sense, doesn't it? And explains so much...Well, I guess I'll see you in hell with all of the other bitches who don't believe in Jesus....

Emm & Patty-

Thank you both so very, very much. Patty, we're FRIENDS now! Wooohoo! Can I borrow some money? ;)

Polka Dot-

It's so nice when you meet someone that respects your own views, and resists trying to kidnap you to Jesus Town, isn't it? Yeah, cursing in Church doesn't go over to well, Been there, done that ;) lol

Gamba-

What's weird is that ever since I've moved to the UK I don't get that "you must love jesus" bullshit. It's really nice...But it's maybe it's because I spend most of my time in pubs...

Rebecca-

After reading 'The Chosen' I was always really interested in Judaism. It was interesting to find out you guys don't believe in the afterlife...Or am I wrong? I think I read that somewhere...Hmmm..Anway, thanks for the link! Will have to watch those!!! Happy Hanukkah!

Huevon & Blue Cat-

Thank you! And yes ppPPppprppRRRRRrrrrRRrrrAaaaAAAAaaAAAAaaaAIIIIIIiiiiiIIiiiIIiiiiSSSSsssssssSsssEEeeeEE

HiiiiiIIiiiIIIiiiIIIIIiimmmmmMmmmMmmmmmMMMMm!!!

Basically. I'm really frustrated. Who would like to buy me a new laptop? WHO? ANYONE???!?!!?

GAARRRAGGHAHHAAaHAHHAH.

Anway. Let's try this again.

Jesus would buy you a new laptop - if you only believed. ;-)

Haha, your grandparents remind me of Kathy Griffin's parents.

I was also raised Catholic. I have a great aunt who was a nun. She went into the convent at 15 years old. 15! no shit! anyway. She got a bit morbid when she got older, taking pictures at viewings and all I mean...taking pictures of the body at viewings...yeesh "Oh, there's Aunt Anita & Uncle John, there's us with mom, there's ....Nana...in the casket....!" but ANYway... she was cool. My dad was not raised Catholic and he never went to church except if it was for our 1st communion etc. and my great aunt the nun loved him just the same as anyone else. So did everyone. But when she would come visit she was never ever anyone you felt was gonna start pushing religion on you or acting like you are doing anything 'wrong'. If it wasn't for the habit you just would have thought she was just another great aunt.

The funniest thing about this is that the Bible which is supposedly what Christians base their faith on never makes mention of "the rapture" it's something that people made up.

I love that making up the rapture is okay, yet whenever you get into a discussion with some hardcore religious person it's always going back to "well the Bible says..." Religious people as a whole are tremendously hypocritical; those such as Kristen excluded. I think it's sad because honestly they Bible does set a good example for how to live a loving and happy life, but few people actually read it or listen to what it says.

"I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ"- Ghandi

The funniest thing about this is that the Bible which is supposedly what Christians base their faith on never makes mention of "the rapture" it's something that people made up.

I love that making up the rapture is okay, yet whenever you get into a discussion with some hardcore religious person it's always going back to "well the Bible says..." Religious people as a whole are tremendously hypocritical; those such as Kristen excluded. I think it's sad because honestly they Bible does set a good example for how to live a loving and happy life, but few people actually read it or listen to what it says.

"I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ"- Ghandi

[this is good]
It's okay, you're not alone. Evangelizing nut jobs can apparently smell the taint of freethought on me from hundreds of yards away. It's like meeting someone knew who wants to introduce you to his invisible friend, and they wonder why you don't want to be friends with the invisible friend, who clearly loves you. Duh.
[das ist gut]
Cate, you are so awesome, that....that I couldn't find a good end to the sentence. I can always find an end to that sentence. that's how awesome you are. your posts are always really fantastic.

I'm on board with the heaven/hell, if they exist, are right here.

I also don't understand the belief in an omnipotent being that requires devotion, NOT partaking of pleasures it is supposed to have created, and is judgemental.

My personal feeling is that an omnipoteng being would be evolved beyond those forms of vanity and game playing.

I think i just have a problem believing in a higher being that does 2 things. 1) allows life to be as miserable as it is for the majority of people living on thie planet. AIDS? Racism? Homophobia? Yeah, I won't devote myself to someone who allows that shit to happen to someone else. 2) If god really does condemn people to hell for them not believing in him, he should make himself a little more believable, and realise that there are a shit load of other religions out there that he is competing with. Yeah, why would I believe one over another? Oh, that's right. I haven't. Oh, and I'll throw in a 3rd just for fun. When i studied abroad in italy my jehovah's witness roommate told me that dinosaur fossils were put in the ground by god, to test our faith. Hey, god? yeah, it's me kate. If you are so insecure with yourself that you need to test me by putting big ugly skeletons in the ground, maybe you should reconsider that whole "master of the universe" thing.. Oh, and if I'm going to hell because you did that, awesome, because i really have no desire to hang out with you for the rest of eternity.
[this is good]
HERE HERE! Luckily for me self rightous christians leave me alone after i accuse their god of being worse than Hitler, and then provide convincing arguments as to why this is so, if they're nice and don't get preachy I spare them, but if they start getting holier than though I make there lives miserable.
[this is good]

....Damn....

Er....Will anyone buy me a bible for Christmas? Anyone?

[isto é bom]

Ruthypants-

Don't you love how I still call you that? Doesn't it just warm you? Bless, we have something special here, Ruthy. We, do. Ah, to think in many, many years we'll be able to sit back and reflect on all the good times we had on Vox, whilst we're knitting in Hell with our Chihuahuas playfull humping Lord Satan's hooves. Maybe then you can show me how to make my hair shiny and bouncy like yours....Sorry, just a fantasy of mine. Anyhoo, yeah I've never actually had a problem with Catholic people, strangly. Anyway, I hope you have a marvelous birth of Christ celebration on Monday...And I hope you get as drunk as I will :) Snorgle Lord Elvis for me! x

Caaate-

aka Alternate Self. I actually no JACK SHIT about the bible. I had to read some of Genesis for school as part of our "world religions" class once, but other than, not so much. People that quote it, and use it as a "source" to condemn others, especially gay people, make me vomit. I just find it hilarious how people live their life around a book. Sure, I grew up basing my beliefs and opinions and teachings of "The Babysitter's Club" but that's just me, ya know? Praise Maryanne and Logan! Love the quote from Ghandi :)

Redzilla-

That's probably the best analogy I've ever heard of. "What??? You DONT SEE HIM?? What's wrong with you? JUST BELIEVE. He seeeees you! Why can't you just love him back??" that's exactly what it's like. Brilliant!!

Dee-

I apologize for stealing your 'ending of sentences' abilities, lol. Thank you :)

Leenda-

Will check out Crixpy's post :) My sound on my laptop decided to stop working for a while, so I'll have to go back and check it out. :) Btw, I am going to respond to your email this century, lol.

Kate-

Yeah, those are pretty good reasons. More so, other than all of the suffering, is just the lack of proof. I'm sorry, I've gotten more proof watching "Most Haunted" about the afterlife than I have from going to church for 14 years of my life. Nevermind all that SCIENCE bullshit, ya know? I have found more faith and more understanding speaking to one of my friends that is heavily into meditation and actually considers herself a 'monk'. I believe in the Universe. I don't even know if that makes sense...But it's just, we know BARELY ANYTHING in regards to space, and time, and the Universe in general..So how can we really expect to be so correct about religion? We're a tiny spec compared to everything else out there that we haven't found yet. I think we get so caught up in OUR world, that we forget that ther are QUADROOOPLYMILLIONS of other things going on out there that we don't even know about...Which is why the meaning of life is CLEARLY 42.

Zack-

Amen. I have a hard time even arguing with them, because arguments like "I believe" and "Because it said so in the Bible" and "because Jesus wishes it to be so" just make me laugh, and laugh, and laugh.

Yeah, it's funny in a wrong kin of way when you say god murdered every first born child in egypt cause the pharaoh ignored moses and they say "oh but thats ok cause god's got a plan".
When people start the "Because it said so in the Bible" argument, I like to come back with the equally cliché anti-bible argument "Well, it also says that you can sell your daughter into slavery, and they we should stone disobedient children. Do you think that's alright?" or, in the case of that it says homosexuality is a sin because it says so in the book of Leviticus, I ask if they like shrimp or lobster, because Leviticus also says that eating shellfish is an abomination.And then when they say not everything in the bible is meant to be take literally or or that it was written in a "different time"(this one is the funniest answer), you can either call them a hypocrite and walk away if you're ready for the conversation to be over, or push a little further and say maybe the homosexuality is wrong part was "written in a different time" or "not literal".
...if you haven't read the letter, "Why can't I own a Canadian?", you should, it's pretty funny.
And as a friend of mine once observed, quoting the Bible to prove the existence of God is like quoting a Spider-man comic book to prove the existence of Spider-man.
[this is good]
Thanks for sharing!
I basically believe that we got here somehow. I don't completely buy into the "man from sludge" theory of evolution. I do believe the theory of evolution just not the part about it being a random set of chain reactions. I feel like something intelligent set that off. What? I have no clue. None of us do. Christians(and other religions) make the mistake of confusing faith and truth. They have faith that their God put man on earth like it says in their Bible and somehow that faith gets turned into belief - then it becomes truth to them and not something that they are very hopeful of. Then the arguing begins.

Not so fast Atheists - You guys are just as guilty. You take things too far. I know that you get irritated by assholes trying to convert you but forcing people to take down Christmas trees in public places is retarded. Christmas has become a celebration of American Consumerism not Christianity. Hell, the tree isn't even a symbol of Christianity. Also, Atheists seem to have a particular disdain for Christianity - more than any other religion. You don't just shun Christianity, you attack it - these attacks cause reprisal and then you attack back then get another reprisal and it becomes a neverending cycle. And assholes that don't look at "Merry Christmas" as a cheerful greeting and get all pissy about it prove my point on this.

So, I guess what I am saying is that everyone should chill out. I don't like people trying to "save" me but I just thank them for caring and move on. If they are persistent, I am polite, I turn down their offer and I distance myself. And for the love of Pete(my personal deity=)) If someone offers you a holiday greeting of any kind, take it as a gesture of good will and move on. I have been invited to Eid(The festival of sorts at the end of Ramadan) and graciously gone. It was really very cool. I am firm in what I believe and am not going to be swayed by any religion but that doesn't mean that I can't learn from the different cultures and find the beauty in them.

I think that if we spent more time trying to be polite and trying to understand each other instead of fueling the fire by acting like asses to each other, there might be more understanding and less irritation. Yes, other's will still continue to be asses and we cannot control that but we can control ourselves and our responses and make them mild, polite and reasonable.

Now, someone hold my fucking hand and sing Kumbaya or I will shoot you in the face!! =)
LOL...as a devout Catholic, I honestly loved reading this post.

The people who you described have no idea what Christianity is...I am annoyed by the "praise and singing" Jesus Freaks as well. As a Christian, we are suppose to engage the modern culture and the people who shape it regardless of religious profession. You can't live a full life by removing yourself from the realities of it such as creating a "Jesus Town." They try to "tidy up reality."

Don't get me wrong, I do believe in God and that the Catholic Church is beautiful, but what these people who encountered you shared, is not Christ. If anything, it is people like them who have done the most harm to Christianity...not the non-believers.

Again, thanks for the post...awesome.

CupCate said: Don't go. Tell your mom if you do go, you will hiss and drool and fornicate in the aisles. It's better for her if you don't go, really. Did you want to come to the "Sinning for Lucifer" confrence next month? I'm sure Ben will be there. Lord Satan usually just sends Ben to do his meet and greets, book signings, and crab feeds for him. I'll send you the details.

That sounds great, I'd love to attend. Sinning for Lucifer sounds much more up my alley than what my mom wants. ;-) i do agree with you that it's better in general if i don't go to church at this point, just because i'm so unsure of what my feelings are on it. plus, my years of catholic schooling have really given me a very good idea of just how i can serve His Evilness best. i do believe Lucifer would be much more helpful in my plans for a hostile world takeover.

plus, being struck by lightning as i cross the threshhold? yeah, not my cup of tea.

[this is good]

Liz-

Lord Satan would definitely help you with the whole "hostile world takeover" thing. In fact, I'll text him and see what he's doing next week. He may have a "Hell In A Hand Basket" pot luck to go to, but I'm sure we'll work something out....

An (not the article)-

Thank you!!! See, I love that your Catholic and can still see the humor/insanity that a lot of Christians produce. Fabulous. I'm glad you enjoyed the post, as I enjoy hearing from regligious folks that don't make me want to stab out my ears. Yay for respect!

Potty Mouth-

Loved your comment. I totally agree with you. It's not like if someone mentions Jesus to me I freak out and scream "GOD DAMN IT!!! HERE WE GO AGAIN!!!!". Random people I can deal with and laugh it off. But it's just when it's friends that do it, and people I thought respected me tell me I'm going to hell, wel, you get the jist. Anyway. That guy in your post that screamed at the friendly barista is a dick. I don't get mad when people say "Merry Christmas" even though I'm not Christian. They're just trying to be nice...

Redzilla-

And KFed really will get custody of his kids because US Weekly is the truth, because, hello! It's the a MAGAZINE. It's in print. They wouldn't just PRINT LIES would they? Duh.

Kate-

I can't stop laughing about the Fossils, thing. "God put those there to test us"...And Darwin was a decoy. God, you sure are tricky, you kidder, you.

Dee-

Holy Shit. I died laughing. Absolutely love that. Thanks for the link. I must spread the joy to all my friends and family...NOW.

Zack & Megan-

Thank you both!!

[this is good]
Great post!! Many thanks for this. I am going to add you in my neighbourhood.

I am someone with lots of doubts w/ respect to religion and I have done some search myself. Have you looked at the Beyond Belief conference website? It's a great start I think for those of us who has questions about these very important issues. The point is that it is very easy for a religious person to argue: it's all about faith, there is no need to have any proof or evidence or rationale. In contrast, science is subject to a much more serious criticism, to scrutinity or peers, to trial and error. And science is humble and recognises the unknown. Many of the speeches of the Beyond Belief 2006 conference website are available at youtube and I am selecting the best for my blog.

I wrote a post recently (unfortunately I have not translated this specific post yet) about a discussion about religion I had recently. One thing that really made me mad was how superior religious people think they are - because they "know" everything. The dogmas of religion and faith give them take away all uncertainties, while people without faith feel much more humble wrt these issues as they recognise that there is a lot that we don't know yet and perhaps will never know.

I believe these questions you have are very important ones. I, humbly, would suggest anyone who is interested in these issues to keep looking for answers - there is so much out there. Agnosticism is just one possibility - don't stop there. Explore other possibilities.
[this is good]

Thank you so much for reading :) I have added you to my 'hood as well! Looking forward to the translation of your post on religion! Will check out the Beyond Belief information... Thanks for the suggestions, and I very much agree with continuing to ask questions...Always changing, always moving, and always questions...I hope you have a pleasant weekend!

[this is good]

Have you been zoning in on my brainwaves? I feel the same way about religion, about people who push to hard and disrespect those who aren't exactly like them!

As my friend Jordan likes to say "Jesus doesn't really love you, he's just saying that to get in your pants!"

[esto es genial]
Yay! I'm so glad I re-found this. And I'm so, so glad it's not just me. And I'm so, so, so glad that there are people like you who can write so well about it. I always just get flustered and start spouting random conjugations of the fuck word. And I foam at the mouth and my eyes roll back in my head and the whatnot. Except with Mormons, they really are weirdly sweet aren't they? They're a guilty pleasure for me, I just adore them. Even when they'd chide me for smoking it was cute. hehee
Wow, what you write is so true! Now I'm a Catholic, and I totally believe that there something greater than us out there, but I also believe in respecting our fellow human beings. I can ever get over these religious extremists! When I went to Uni, I lived in halls with two super lovely Islamic girls. One of my very best friends is Islamic, another one is Buddhist, another one atheist ans so the list goes. Anyhoo, when at Uni, my best friend asked could I please go with her to this Chrstian group meeting thingy because some girl in her class was bugging her to go and she didn't want to go alone. So off we both happily went. That is until one of the members started giving the whole "non-Christians are all going to Hell and burn in fire and brimstone for all eternity" jazz. So I asked "are you implying that my beautiful, lovely, super loyal Islamic/Buddhist?Atheist friends are going to burn in Hell???". "Er... well.... they should read the Bible and have Jesus in their heart!" Translation: "yes, the will burn and be chargrilled in Hell!!!" At which point I left (so did best friend) and never went back. I just don't get it... surely if they are so Christian, they should "not onto others that which they would not have them do onto them" etc etc. Surely they wouldn't want people of other religions tell them their best friends are damned for eternity? Surely? Sorry for the long post. I'll shut up now! PS: I've added you to my neighbourhood, hope you don't mind! :)

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CupCate
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